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We don't need to post gruesome pictures here to discuss the topic.

I thought we'd been discussing the pictures in this thread.

 

 

 

 

 

We need a VIP forum.

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Hmm there's no need to post the photos on here but can we talk about them... maybe in detail?

 

Anyways I've seen the "photos" of the other two men killed, but don't know of their credibility. For sure OBL was the only tango that was extracted with the team and that anyone coming into the compound afterwards would just see the aftermath.

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Reports say that one of his wives (wounded during the assault) positively IDed him as being him. He was also positively identified when a photo of his body was shown to another one of his wives. DNA testing was confirmed to be him when compared to various DNA samples from his family members.

He was identify after his death, I mean what they may killed civilians as easely as they shot himself (if they shot). I just impressed by that easiness by which your "elite" soldiers kills people. That would be Ok if they'd be armed, but what (and I mean WHAAAAAAAT!!!!) may did unarmed woman to your elite soldiers? Do they know such a thing like handcuffs? They came to another countrie, killed unarmed people and they proud of that... What the hell is happens with the west? You trust your government like you even don't trust your mother. Hope someday life will teach you like it taught myself - there is no man who should be trusted! If you trust somebody you are at great danger, coz there is a big bunch of people who always in seek of such people to make them believe in something and make profit of it. And I mean by that not just some froads, but big companies either and your dearest government. Who lied once will lie twice. And we (Russia) know what he is lier (Obama or whoever rules this countrie) and I would say by all of us what only last fool here believe in your goverment. You don't see it inside, coz you are fed up with "facts". We call it OBS, what you call "facts". OBS - Odna Babka Skazala - One Grandma Said. Your government is just rule your thoughts (and therefore yourself) by your emotions. They've put in your mind fear and act on it. I don't believe your government. If I'll be wrong in the end - that's Ok - I'm wrong, Ok. But if I'll be trusting them and act like they want me to act, then... Sorry there should be BIIIIG troubles..

His family members were interviewed (at least those who chose to be interviewed). If you read up on the subject, his family members distanced themselves from him after he formed al Qaeda. They even went to as far as to changing their names, mostly different variations of the last name (ex. Binladin)

I would like to see video or even just photo of at least one of them. Not "we told with them, they said that and that". Why should I trust in such information? And I mean... WHYYYYYYYYYY?!!! Why the hell?!!! Whyyyy?...

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He was identify after his death, I mean what they may killed civilians as easely as they shot himself (if they shot). I just impressed by that easiness by which your "elite" soldiers kills people.

 

These "elite" soldiers are trained to kill, and are damn good at it. Plus when you're in the heat of the moment, you don't think it's all instinct and muscle memory. Whether or not OBL had a weapon, it doesn't matter. He's dead now. It wouldn't make much difference if a civilian (like myself) shot bin Laden. Believe me if I had the very opportunity to, I would put two in his head with or without a weapon. Am I a murder for that? Sure. But OBL's dead and that's what the world wants to hear.

 

That would be Ok if they'd be armed, but what (and I mean WHAAAAAAAT!!!!) may did unarmed woman to your elite soldiers? Do they know such a thing like handcuffs? They came to another countrie, killed unarmed people and they proud of that...

 

Ever heard of a little thing called collateral damage. When any sort of action is taken that involves committing armed forces to a combat situation. There will be collateral damage. It sucks that she was killed but it's not like we pushed her against the wall executed her. It's funny to me how everyone always expects a happily ever after. The standards you're putting on my country's servicemen are too high compared to your own probably. You probably wouldn't say anything if she wasn't killed. And because she was, and they didn't intend it to happen, we're automatically the evil pigs who come and kill everyone we felt like killing? Doesn't work that way.

 

What the hell is happens with the west? You trust your government like you even don't trust your mother. Hope someday life will teach you like it taught myself - there is no man who should be trusted! If you trust somebody you are at great danger, coz there is a big bunch of people who always in seek of such people to make them believe in something and make profit of it.

 

That's how it works everywhere. You don't have to trust anyone, but if you're not even qualified or capable of doing a particular task it's probably best to leave it to someone who is. I'm sorry that you probably have no faith in your government but don't take it all out on us just because we do.

 

 

And I mean by that not just some froads, but big companies either and your dearest government. Who lied once will lie twice. And we (Russia) know what he is lier (Obama or whoever rules this countrie) and I would say by all of us what only last fool here believe in your goverment.

 

So why should you care? ... plus you're going off topic here

 

You don't see it inside, coz you are fed up with "facts". We call it OBS, what you call "facts". OBS - Odna Babka Skazala - One Grandma Said. Your government is just rule your thoughts (and therefore yourself) by your emotions. They've put in your mind fear and act on it.

 

So.... if I turned on the news, see something I was interested in, go out of my way to do my own research on it and draw my own conclusion, you'd still call it "она бабка Ñказала"? Do you really believe that I trust everything that my own government says? Hell I didn't even vote for Obama, and I sure as Hell don't agree with some of his policies; and that's the beauty of it. I don't have to because I'm not some mindless robot you're saying that I am. I am free to think what I think and say what I want to say. My government can care less about that because they're too busy doing more important things than feeding me BS, that's the job of the private news agencies. And even I don't trust them outright, because I don't have to.

 

I don't believe your government.

 

You don't have to.

 

If I'll be wrong in the end - that's Ok - I'm wrong, Ok. But if I'll be trusting them and act like they want me to act, then... Sorry there should be BIIIIG troubles..

 

Act on what. They're not telling you to do anything. Better yet, they can't tell you to do anything because you're in Russia. So why should you care if 'we' tell you do act a certain way.

 

I would like to see video or even just photo of at least one of them. Not "we told with them, they said that and that". Why should I trust in such information? And I mean... WHYYYYYYYYYY?!!! Why the hell?!!! Whyyyy?...

 

Dude, there's a little thing called "Google". There's something called a 'search bar' and you use it to type in the words "Osama bin Laden family member interview" or any combination thereof. After you click on 'search' it will take you to a list of websites that will have such interviews you may be after.

 

Why do you think that the only information people get are from news agencies and the government? This is the Information Age, dude. You can do your own homework instead of waiting for the 'government peoples' to publish information that you would be satisfied as being true. Nothing is ever fed to you so easily...

Edited by sirbenedictvs
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These "elite" soldiers are trained to kill, and are damn good at it. Plus when you're in the heat of the moment, you don't think it's all instinct and muscle memory. Whether or not OBL had a weapon, it doesn't matter. He's dead now. It wouldn't make much difference if a civilian (like myself) shot bin Laden. Believe me if I had the very opportunity to, I would put two in his head with or without a weapon. Am I a murder for that? Sure. But OBL's dead and that's what the world wants to hear.

Ok I see you have different kind of soldiers for killing and for arrest. Hope I'm not right. They could throw gass there or whatever. What if he held some hostages? I just glad what they didn't killed any kid. At the end we can only guess now what surely have heppened there, although Obama watched everything and surely there are some vids. Why they wouldn't uncover it if everything was clear?

 

Ever heard of a little thing called collateral damage. When any sort of action is taken that involves committing armed forces to a combat situation. There will be collateral damage. It sucks that she was killed but it's not like we pushed her against the wall executed her. It's funny to me how everyone always expects a happily ever after. The standards you're putting on my country's servicemen are too high compared to your own probably. You probably wouldn't say anything if she wasn't killed. And because she was, and they didn't intend it to happen, we're automatically the evil pigs who come and kill everyone we felt like killing? Doesn't work that way

"it's not like we pushed her against the wall executed her" sorry, but after all what I've heard I imagining it like that.. Maybe your army standards is higher technically or whatsoever, but I do believe what we have something in our soldiers which always made us win (maybe soul and heart... Maybe... )) ). I'm impressed not only by her death, but by other unarmed people either.

 

That's how it works everywhere. You don't have to trust anyone, but if you're not even qualified or capable of doing a particular task it's probably best to leave it to someone who is. I'm sorry that you probably have no faith in your government but don't take it all out on us just because we do.

I believe in my goverment more then in yours. Although I never take thier words siriously.. But I do believe what they are right in... some points...

 

So why should you care? ... plus you're going off topic here

I should care coz they may come to my countrie like that in search of terrorists which they'll thought-up and kill people as easely as they did it there.. But it's not like I much care about that...

 

So.... if I turned on the news, see something I was interested in, go out of my way to do my own research on it and draw my own conclusion, you'd still call it "она бабка Ñказала"? Do you really believe that I trust everything that my own government says? Hell I didn't even vote for Obama, and I sure as Hell don't agree with some of his policies; and that's the beauty of it. I don't have to because I'm not some mindless robot you're saying that I am. I am free to think what I think and say what I want to say. My government can care less about that because they're too busy doing more important things than feeding me BS, that's the job of the private news agencies. And even I don't trust them outright, because I don't have to.

I trying to use logic (to separate the wheat from the chaff), sometimes it helps... "My government can care less about that because they're too busy doing more important things than feeding me BS" - there is no more important things for them then... Sorry, but trying to make a fool of its own people. And I am hearing this thought not at first... Somebody told me exactly the same.. Exuse.

 

You don't have to.

Yeah I am.. But they want to... I suppose...

 

Act on what. They're not telling you to do anything. Better yet, they can't tell you to do anything because you're in Russia. So why should you care if 'we' tell you do act a certain way.

I meant that theoretically... A little bit... If I would live there.. And they don't tell it litterelly, they suppose what people will do after they'll put some thoughts in thier mind..

 

Dude, there's a little thing called "Google". There's something called a 'search bar' and you use it to type in the words "Osama bin Laden family member interview" or any combination thereof. After you click on 'search' it will take you to a list of websites that will have such interviews you may be after.

 

Why do you think that the only information people get are from news agencies and the government? This is the Information Age, dude. You can do your own homework instead of waiting for the 'government peoples' to publish information that you would be satisfied as being true. Nothing is ever fed to you so easily...

Oh yeah, I found some of them. Why they didn't shown them on TV? Yeah, I def will do some research... Will read those intervews at least... But won't trust them ))) Loool ).. ((

P.S. I think it's however better to not going deeply into all those goverment things... I mean... What the hell can we change? Who is seriously ask for our opinion? They will do what they are doing whatever we think....

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Ok I see you have different kind of soldiers for killing and for arrest. Hope I'm not right. They could throw gass there or whatever. What if he held some hostages? I just glad what they didn't killed any kid. At the end we can only guess now what surely have heppened there, although Obama watched everything and surely there are some vids. Why they wouldn't uncover it if everything was clear?

 

I have some idea of how they would operate. If they do a textbook building take-down it will involve using flashbangs (flash/stun grenade) to incapacitate anyone inside the rooms giving the shooters the advantage of distinguishing who the threats are. The take-down would occur methodically going through room by room, they wouldn't know which room he would be in so ever room would be checked and this takes precious time possibly giving any occupants inside to arm themselves or escape. Some reports say that OBL used a woman as a 'human shield' while other say she ran to get in between him and the bullets flying. She wasn't intended to be shot but things happen really fast. (the take-down of that room would've taken anywhere between 4-7 seconds).

 

Yes Obama was watching the assault as it happened but it's still unclear what sort of media he was watching through. The most likely thing would be that he was watching from overhead. Cameras would've been mounted on the helicopters and/or gunships that were orbiting over the compound. There's also the possibility of an unmanned drone flying above with a high resolution camera. Still if these were the case, it would be difficult to determine what was going on inside since he would only be able to see the overhead feed and radio chatter. The other possibility is that some of the assaulters may have helmet or gun mounted cameras which would allow the President and his cabinet to watch the entire thing unfold. The latter would probably be the most difficult to make public considering of the sensitive matter that may be present in regards to the identities of that SEAL team, their tactics and equipment.

 

It probably won't be for a number of years before any credible details would be made public. There are still a lot of details from the 1993 Mogadishu battle which are still 'classified'.

 

"it's not like we pushed her against the wall executed her" sorry, but after all what I've heard I imagining it like that.. Maybe your army standards is higher technically or whatsoever, but I do believe what we have something in our soldiers which always made us win (maybe soul and heart... Maybe... )) ). I'm impressed not only by her death, but by other unarmed people either.

 

Definitely. Anyone in the armed forces and especially in any special operations forces (our Navy SEALS or your Spetznaz)are highly motivated and highly trained individuals. They know what needs to be done and they know how to do it right. They're not cold-hearted killers that many would think they are. Because underneath all those weapons and gear, they're still human beings.

 

I believe in my goverment more then in yours. Although I never take thier words siriously.. But I do believe what they are right in... some points...

 

It's never a bad thing to have faith in your own government. And there's nothing wrong with being skeptical with others. Nobody should trust their government's words exactly because they have their own agenda. It now comes down to doing appropriate research on whatever subject and making your own conclusions.

 

I should care coz they may come to my countrie like that in search of terrorists which they'll thought-up and kill people as easely as they did it there.. But it's not like I much care about that...

 

That may be a possibility but we don't really have any wanted fugitives in Russia... or at least none that most of us know of. Most of these fugitives are believed to be in various countries of the Middle East, Southeast Asia and some Western European countries as well. Like I said it's a possibility but I definitely hope that they're very careful about it. Although the Cold War has ended, the US and the Russian Federation still have very tense relations with each other. If something goes wrong, there would be Hell to pay between the two countries. The relationship between the US and Russia are too sensitive to even attempt something like that.

 

I trying to use logic (to separate the wheat from the chaff), sometimes it helps... "My government can care less about that because they're too busy doing more important things than feeding me BS" - there is no more important things for them then... Sorry, but trying to make a fool of its own people. And I am hearing this thought not at first... Somebody told me exactly the same.. Exuse.

 

And I'd assume you gave him the same answer I gave you? There's always a separation between the government and its people. We do our jobs, and they do theirs. The government's main function isn't to fool their people. The government's main function is to govern their people (make laws, provide services, etc.)

 

I meant that theoretically... A little bit... If I would live there.. And they don't tell it litterelly, they suppose what people will do after they'll put some thoughts in thier mind..

 

See that's the thing. The government has no control over what you do and don't believe. You wouldn't (or shouldn't) be in such a situation where you're stuck to being brainwashed. The government can't and don't force you to believe what they tell you. I mean there are still a lot of so called "9/11 Truthers" that believe the September 11th attacks were planned by the US government. The government isn't doing anything to shut them up because they have every right to say such things.

 

Oh yeah, I found some of them. Why they didn't shown them on TV? Yeah, I def will do some research... Will read those intervews at least... But won't trust them ))) Loool ).. ((

P.S. I think it's however better to not going deeply into all those goverment things... I mean... What the hell can we change? Who is seriously ask for our opinion? They will do what they are doing whatever we think....

 

You never know dude, if there's something someone uncovered which showed any sort of wrong doing. With the proper resources the good citizen can put an end to that. Which explains why some politicians were indicted for less than reputable things. Best example of this would be the Watergate Scandal where President Nixon committed illegal espionage on his opponents. He was uncovered by an anonymous whistle-blower known as Deep Throat. Shortly afterwards, President Nixon resigned. A lot of Hell rained down on President Reagan as well when the people found out about his contra supplying operation.

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  • 1 month later...

blah so this thread hasnt been posted in in a month but i just saw this now so what the heck -_-

 

this is a bit off topic but the killing of Saddam Hussein was inhumane, being hanged in the 21st century...

 

The fact that people can sympathize with a murderer, whether dead or alive i couldn't care less, but it's ridiculous. He deserved everything he got, and it's sad that he was hanged.. (apparently it's less painless?). For all the thousands of people he tortured and murdered, he deserved to go through that pain himself.

 

I have kurdish blood from my mum's side.. and i'm sure everyone is familiar with the kurdish genocide, and what Saddam and his brother did to the kurds. How they used gases and chemical weapons on living innocent humans. How they tortured and imprisoned THOUSANDS of people for their beliefs or nationality. Kinda reminds me of Harry Potter actually.. if you're not "pure blooded" you get thrown out to the dogs. Haha.

 

Whether its Osama Bin Laden and his terrorist attacks against the Americans in 9/11 killing innocent civilians, or Saddam and his evil dictatorship, these are ALL terrorists and murderers and evil men who bring no good to this world and harmed innocent people. They don't deserve to be here for one day and they don't deserve sympathy or pity.

 

For those of you who don't personally know someone who died under the hands of these terrorists maybe the pain isn't as raw. But if it was your mother, or your father, or your sister or brother who was killed.. you wouldn't for a day feel pity that people are celebrating their death. If it makes people feel safer and happier in a world without them, they have every right to be happy about it. Atleast justice was served.

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Unreal, if you meant myself I never said what I symphathize Osama, I just don't 100%ly believe what he've been murdered. And if he was and all this true it have been done in inapropriate way. That's all what I said. Yes, he deserved to go through the pain (if everyhting what have been said about him is true), but being killed by the bullit it isn't as much painfull as you may think. If he'd have been taken alive and then tortured to give information about his organization then, maybe it would be even more fair from your point of view.

(Ups, sorry, now I see what you told it to Reznov, but I think he didn't symphasize him either, just meant what it have been done inappropriately)

 

Sirbenedictvs, sorry what I didn't replyed, I just thought what it may lead to a quarrel and I don't want any quarrels...

 

Definitely. Anyone in the armed forces and especially in any special operations forces (our Navy SEALS or your Spetznaz)are highly motivated and highly trained individuals. They know what needs to be done and they know how to do it right. They're not cold-hearted killers that many would think they are. Because underneath all those weapons and gear, they're still human beings.

I meant what I think what Russian soldiers wouldn't ever kill unarmed or innocent people, coz they listen to their conscience (I mean moral sence of right and wrong) more then yours. But of course it is just my opinion and I may be wrong...

 

That may be a possibility but we don't really have any wanted fugitives in Russia... or at least none that most of us know of. Most of these fugitives are believed to be in various countries of the Middle East, Southeast Asia and some Western European countries as well. Like I said it's a possibility but I definitely hope that they're very careful about it. Although the Cold War has ended, the US and the Russian Federation still have very tense relations with each other. If something goes wrong, there would be Hell to pay between the two countries. The relationship between the US and Russia are too sensitive to even attempt something like that.

That is what I do care about. Our relationships is, well, yeah, very tense. And I think what there are still some possiblities of war bitween our counties. But I just hope what it forever will be just "some posiblities".

 

And I'd assume you gave him the same answer I gave you? There's always a separation between the government and its people. We do our jobs, and they do theirs. The government's main function isn't to fool their people. The government's main function is to govern their people (make laws, provide services, etc.)

They can't live without lying to its people. Coz they always, well, you know "have to" (in their opinion) do something wrong and they just can't survive without hiding some facts or tell honest untrue. I don't think what there are somewhere even one honest governer. They all are lyers. That is fact for me.

 

See that's the thing. The government has no control over what you do and don't believe. You wouldn't (or shouldn't) be in such a situation where you're stuck to being brainwashed. The government can't and don't force you to believe what they tell you. I mean there are still a lot of so called "9/11 Truthers" that believe the September 11th attacks were planned by the US government. The government isn't doing anything to shut them up because they have every right to say such things.

And I one of those.... who... do not... fully regret that theory ))) They have control to show on TV anything what they want (and I don't think what USA's have not either). That's why I do not watch it at all. And honestly you wouldn't watch it here either - our main channels on TV is pure s... I must admit that..

 

You never know dude, if there's something someone uncovered which showed any sort of wrong doing. With the proper resources the good citizen can put an end to that. Which explains why some politicians were indicted for less than reputable things. Best example of this would be the Watergate Scandal where President Nixon committed illegal espionage on his opponents. He was uncovered by an anonymous whistle-blower known as Deep Throat. Shortly afterwards, President Nixon resigned. A lot of Hell rained down on President Reagan as well when the people found out about his contra supplying operation.

Yeah, my uncle have been killed for such a thing... And I wanna lived at least untill his ages...

Edited by NobleManiac
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