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The R/Hr And H/Hr Debate Thread Version 5.0


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Okay folks, so here's to kicking off the newest installment of the Harry/Hermione and Ron/Hermione Debate thread.

I would just implore all members to keep any conversations respectful and do to their best to support their beliefs/feelings through evidence as it is presented in the literature. Also, it should be noted that members should do their best to distinguish movie scenes from the canon (book scenes) when referencing something that might have been portrayed differently in the movies.

We all know who ends up with who... but please feel free to tell us why you support the ship you do. Please try to refrain from character defamation, as we should all celebrate each and everyone of JKR's wonderful characters. The most effective and enlightening perspectives come from those of us who choose to focus on the postive attributes of the characters in our respective ships, so try and keep an open mind to the sensabilities of a different POV.

Well... I guess that's all that needs to be said for now... so let the debates begin!!!!!! :king: Edited by Peter Pumpkinhead
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I was going to reply to this topic but wanted to craft a thoughtful response. I think a lot of people might be staying away from this subject for fear of it turning into a flame war even though you implored them not to.

Well, I still haven't crafted the response I'd like but I'm going to include a link to an article that puts forth a lot of the reasons I feel the way I feel about the relationship.

I would've like to have seen H/Hr end up as a couple and here's some of the reasons why: [url="http://blog.moviefone.com/2010/11/23/harry-potter-hermione-ron-weasley-love/"]Forget Ron Weasley! Could Hermione Have Ended Up With Harry?[/url]
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1292599678' post='29010']
I was going to reply to this topic but wanted to craft a thoughtful response.
[/quote]

I'm on the same page, The Dude. I really want to sit down and crack open some of the novels and find some evidence, first, as I think it's necessary to back up my ideas with some facts. I believe it prevents other shippers reading my work from becoming irate because they do not see "hard", clear evidence.
I will come out and say, though, that I am a H/Hr shipper. I was a R/Hr shipper early on in the novels. However, around 2004 I "converted" (I guess you would say) and saw what I believed was a better chemistry between Harry and Hermione and better odds for a relationship (and this is [i]not[/i] coming from watching the movies). Since many people here do not want to mix movie with book form, I will not mention movie form.
I would like to say, though, that reading through some of the posts in the other thread(s) completely shocked me. I believe the "Shipper War" was over by 2006. No ship technically "won". I am not sure why there was blatant name-calling and typecasting going on in that thread. Just because a stereotype has a speck of truth in it--that is, true only for the minority--(it is, then, a half-truth, really) does not mean it fits for the [i]whole[/i] group. That's like fitting the circlular peg in to the square whole type of thing.
I would urge people who decide to post in this Debate thread to keep the harsh remarks down to a minimum. There are ways of portraying your arguments accurately, and respectfully, to others without the need to rehash a ruckus. We've come to this Forum to discuss our ideas and opinions with each other--in a community--regardless of the forum or subforum we submit our posts to.
Another point to mention: Life is not completely black and white. Many times, we operate in the "gray matter", whether we are presently aware of it or not. When receiving ideas, or learning new things, there is a necessity of entering into this "gray" area, in which ideas are not completely formed or cannot be catagorized by putting it into a specific side.
I would implore any one who is willing to post their ideas to be willing to enter into this area.
I will post my evidence later, when I have time to have a sit down with the Potter novels.
Good luck, guys (and gals).
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1292599678' post='29010']
I would've like to have seen H/Hr end up as a couple and here's some of the reasons why: [url="http://blog.moviefone.com/2010/11/23/harry-potter-hermione-ron-weasley-love/"]Forget Ron Weasley! Could Hermione Have Ended Up With Harry?[/url]
[/quote]This is the kind of thing I had hoped we would NOT get in this thread. I read the blog and it's highly offensive towards OBHWF shippers and to Ron fans as well as Ginny fans. I still maintain my conviction that it is indeed possible to argue a ship without resorting to denigrade a beloved wonderful character. Why isn't it possible to just explain why you prefer H/Hr WITHOUT putting down Ron (using biased and selective arguments at that)??? If that's really absolutely impossible, then I have to draw the conclusion that the H/Hr ship, or rather someone's belief in it, isn't very strong and very founded in the first place. I NEVER argued my ship, R/Hr, by putting down Harry. NEVER. And I am sure it's possible for H/HR too. I am even willing to do so in this thread. I am a die-hard R/Hr shipper, there is no way in the world that could be changed, but in the R/Hr thread I agreed that it would be interesting to play "devil's advocate" and argue pro H/Hr. Not against R/Hr, just pro H/Hr. Why they would make a good couple. I will do so in this thread, but I won't take any Ron or Ginny bashing. I just think it's fair to make that clear right from the beginning. I am hoping for an open, civilized and inspiring discussion.

Well, lets start: I think Harry and Hermione share something special as in they both grew up in the Muggle world and have been thrown into the Wizarding world without knowing too much about it. Except in Hermione's case of course what she read in books. But it must have been terrifying for them and I think no wizard or witch who grew up with magic can quite understand how it feels to come from "oustide" so to speak.
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Sorry. Accidentally clicked wrong button.

But while we're at it, I just reread my previous post and noticed something that could be misunderstood. I meant, I am sure it's possible to argue for H/Hr without putting down Ron or Ginny.

Edited by galadriel12
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[quote name='galadriel12' timestamp='1292669923' post='29285']
This is the kind of thing I had hoped we would NOT get in this thread. I read the blog and it's highly offensive towards OBHWF shippers and to Ron fans as well as Ginny fans. I still maintain my conviction that it is indeed possible to argue a ship without resorting to denigrade a beloved wonderful character. Why isn't it possible to just explain why you prefer H/Hr WITHOUT putting down Ron (using biased and selective arguments at that)??? If that's really absolutely impossible, then I have to draw the conclusion that the H/Hr ship, or rather someone's belief in it, isn't very strong and very founded in the first place. I NEVER argued my ship, R/Hr, by putting down Harry. NEVER. And I am sure it's possible for H/HR too. I am even willing to do so in this thread. I am a die-hard R/Hr shipper, there is no way in the world that could be changed, but in the R/Hr thread I agreed that it would be interesting to play "devil's advocate" and argue pro H/Hr. Not against R/Hr, just pro H/Hr. Why they would make a good couple. I will do so in this thread, but I won't take any Ron or Ginny bashing. I just think it's fair to make that clear right from the beginning. I am hoping for an open, civilized and inspiring discussion.

Well, lets start: I think Harry and Hermione share something special as in they both grew up in the Muggle world and have been thrown into the Wizarding world without knowing too much about it. Except in Hermione's case of course what she read in books. But it must have been terrifying for them and I think no wizard or witch who grew up with magic can quite understand how it feels to come from "oustide" so to speak.
[/quote]

"I still maintain my conviction that it is indeed impossible to argue a ship without resorting to denigrade a beloved wonderful character."

I am of the opinion that it is not impossible to debate a particular 'ship wihout resorting to degrading another character. I read the blog as well, and to tell you the truth, I did not quite like it at all. I felt it was insufficient enough to explain H/Hr to a R/Hr shipper. And, the diction in the blog article was not what I would have chosen in terms of trying to appeal to a mass of people (especially on MovieFone). I mean, really, you're just going to blatantly state your opinion without any consideration for other people? I mean, what do these people expect? The blog writer was a little thick.
She did make some good points. But, very few--i.e. Harry is a very "observant" person...just to state a premise.
I think your playing "Devil's Advocate" is a good idea. I used to be a R/Hr shipper. So, here goes: I suppose...Ron has the type of character that promotes "funniness, affability, and a resilient nature." Notice, I did not say "comic relief" because it denotes that, that is his primary function and he thus becomes merely a secondary character. He becomes relegated to the background, in other words.
The thing with Ron is: his nature is one that works well in conjunction with Hermione's serious persona. The friction between the two--the tension--plays off a sort of "banter" that, contrary to this blog writer's suggestion that Ron would not offer "intellectual stimulation", gives Hermione a challenge to enter into argument. She's always been one for debate.
Though Harry would be the one to match Hermione wit for wit (at times) and offer an "intellectual" sort of banter, Ron keeps Hermione in shape--both physically (running after him if he decides to make emotional decisions [think back to when Ron left Hermione and Harry in [i]Deathly Hallows[/i]--the novel, I am mentioning, even though it happened in the movie]), mentally (all that irritation has to get her thinking), and emotionally (the range of emotions she would feel as a result would be incredible).
Well, I reckon my fellow H/Hr shippers (after reading this) would disown me. :lol:
But, hey, you started off playing on the H/Hr side, so I figured it would only be wise to offer some premises for the R/Hr side.
Happy debating!! ;)
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[quote name='galadriel12' timestamp='1292669923' post='29285']
This is the kind of thing I had hoped we would NOT get in this thread. I read the blog and it's highly offensive towards OBHWF shippers and to Ron fans as well as Ginny fans. I still maintain my conviction that it is indeed possible to argue a ship without resorting to denigrade a beloved wonderful character. Why isn't it possible to just explain why you prefer H/Hr WITHOUT putting down Ron (using biased and selective arguments at that)??? [b]If that's really absolutely impossible, then I have to draw the conclusion that the H/Hr ship, or rather someone's belief in it, isn't very strong and very founded in the first place.[/b] I NEVER argued my ship, R/Hr, by putting down Harry. NEVER. And I am sure it's possible for H/HR too. I am even willing to do so in this thread. I am a die-hard R/Hr shipper, there is no way in the world that could be changed, but in the R/Hr thread I agreed that it would be interesting to play "devil's advocate" and argue pro H/Hr. Not against R/Hr, just pro H/Hr. Why they would make a good couple. I will do so in this thread, but I won't take any Ron or Ginny bashing. I just think it's fair to make that clear right from the beginning. I am hoping for an open, civilized and inspiring discussion.

Well, lets start: I think Harry and Hermione share something special as in they both grew up in the Muggle world and have been thrown into the Wizarding world without knowing too much about it. Except in Hermione's case of course what she read in books. But it must have been terrifying for them and I think no wizard or witch who grew up with magic can quite understand how it feels to come from "oustide" so to speak.
[/quote]

Ok, I have to say that I agree with you, that bashing Ron (and Ginny) is very annoying and it's stupid to use that against a canon ship. Although the part that I highlighted irked me a bit. I'm sure you didn't mean ALL H/Hr shippers, because I've met most that never bash Ron, we understand the importance of Ron in the trio. And the fact that just because some people bash Ron doesn't mean we don't have a "strong and found belief" in the couple. If I could, besides the one point you mentioned, make an entire 10 page essay on how H/Hr can and DO work.


[quote name='K.Lo' timestamp='1292690514' post='29350']
"I still maintain my conviction that it is indeed impossible to argue a ship without resorting to denigrade a beloved wonderful character."

I am of the opinion that it is not impossible to debate a particular 'ship wihout resorting to degrading another character. I read the blog as well, and to tell you the truth, I did not quite like it at all. I felt it was insufficient enough to explain H/Hr to a R/Hr shipper. And, the diction in the blog article was not what I would have chosen in terms of trying to appeal to a mass of people (especially on MovieFone). I mean, really, you're just going to blatantly state your opinion without any consideration for other people? I mean, what do these people expect? The blog writer was a little thick.
She did make some good points. But, very few--i.e. Harry is a very "observant" person...just to state a premise.
I think your playing "Devil's Advocate" is a good idea. I used to be a R/Hr shipper. So, here goes: I suppose...Ron has the type of character that promotes "funniness, affability, and a resilient nature." Notice, I did not say "comic relief" because it denotes that, that is his primary function and he thus becomes merely a secondary character. He becomes relegated to the background, in other words.
The thing with Ron is: his nature is one that works well in conjunction with Hermione's serious persona. The friction between the two--the tension--plays off a sort of "banter" that, contrary to this blog writer's suggestion that Ron would not offer "intellectual stimulation", gives Hermione a challenge to enter into argument. She's always been one for debate.
Though Harry would be the one to match Hermione wit for wit (at times) and offer an "intellectual" sort of banter, Ron keeps Hermione in shape--both physically (running after him if he decides to make emotional decisions [think back to when Ron left Hermione and Harry in [i]Deathly Hallows[/i]--the novel, I am mentioning, even though it happened in the movie]), mentally (all that irritation has to get her thinking), and emotionally (the range of emotions she would feel as a result would be incredible).
Well, I reckon my fellow H/Hr shippers (after reading this) would disown me. :lol:
But, hey, you started off playing on the H/Hr side, so I figured it would only be wise to offer some premises for the R/Hr side.
Happy debating!! ;)
[/quote]

^ I don't disown you :) You do have a valid point, but how I counter that is the "banter" between Ron and Hermione, [b]to me[/b], is like banter between a brother and sister. Your siblings (or people you feel like are your siblings) are some of the most important people to help you grow as a person, you learn new things from them everyday (like patience) and in the end we would do ANYTHING for our siblings. I think sibling banter is the best kind of banter because it can be physical, mental, and emotion. They both help each other grow as people, learn new things, think new things, and feel new things. This could be used for a good reason why R/Hr work, and YES it is a valid reason... but I personally feel that the banter the two of them have is like the banter between a brother and sister.


Like others have said, I'll be back when I can have good solid "evidence" for H/Hr, I want you R/Hr are shippers to see the possibility and understand H/Hr. And I certainly hope more R/Hr shippers come in here and explain to us H/Hr shippers why you feel R/Hr work, because I've yet to find valid reasons, and I want you to make us H/Hr shippers UNDERSTAND R/Hr better. Edited by lavieenrose
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[quote name='lavieenrose' timestamp='1292811431' post='30151']
Ok, I have to say that I agree with you, that bashing Ron (and Ginny) is very annoying and it's stupid to use that against a canon ship. Although the part that I highlighted irked me a bit. I'm sure you didn't mean ALL H/Hr shippers, because I've met most that never bash Ron, we understand the importance of Ron in the trio. And the fact that just because some people bash Ron doesn't mean we don't have a "strong and found belief" in the couple. If I could, besides the one point you mentioned, make an entire 10 page essay on how H/Hr can and DO work.




^ I don't disown you :) You do have a valid point, but how I counter that is the "banter" between Ron and Hermione, [b]to me[/b], is like banter between a brother and sister. Your siblings (or people you feel like are your siblings) are some of the most important people to help you grow as a person, you learn new things from them everyday (like patience) and in the end we would do ANYTHING for our siblings. I think sibling banter is the best kind of banter because it can be physical, mental, and emotion. They both help each other grow as people, learn new things, think new things, and feel new things. This could be used for a good reason why R/Hr work, and YES it is a valid reason... but I personally feel that the banter the two of them have is like the banter between a brother and sister.


Like others have said, I'll be back when I can have good solid "evidence" for H/Hr, I want you R/Hr are shippers to see the possibility and understand H/Hr. And [b]I certainly hope more R/Hr shippers come in here and explain to us H/Hr shippers why you feel R/Hr work, because I've yet to find valid reasons, and I want you to make us H/Hr shippers UNDERSTAND R/Hr better.[/b]
[/quote]

It's simple: Ron and Hermione love each other, and the love can't be explained. :)
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[quote name='Luciana' timestamp='1292813248' post='30160']
It's simple: Ron and Hermione love each other, and the love can't be explained. :)
[/quote]

Sorry babe, not a valid enough reason. I [i]know[/i] they love each other, but it doesn't sell me on them. I want to know how you, as an R/Hr shipper, feel what made them fall in love with each other. What is it that Hermione loves about Ron? What is it that Ron loves about Hermione? Edited by lavieenrose
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[quote name='lavieenrose' timestamp='1292811431' post='30151']
Ok, I have to say that I agree with you, that bashing Ron (and Ginny) is very annoying and it's stupid to use that against a canon ship. Although the part that I highlighted irked me a bit. I'm sure you didn't mean ALL H/Hr shippers, because I've met most that never bash Ron, we understand the importance of Ron in the trio. And the fact that just because some people bash Ron doesn't mean we don't have a "strong and found belief" in the couple. If I could, besides the one point you mentioned, make an entire 10 page essay on how H/Hr can and DO work.
[/quote]
Of course I didn't mean to generalize. I'm sorry if it came across that way, should have used some kind of disclaimer like "some" or so. However, if you read that sentence in its context I think (hope) it's clear it was a reply to the linked blog and people who argue likewise, not to ALL H/Hr shippers. I have the impression that shippers, whatever they ship, who need to denigrade other characters or relationships to argue for their ship, must not be very secure in their own ship in the first place.

I am sure you could provide a lot of arguments on why H/Hr work, just as I can do the same for R/Hr, but I have to leave that to my fellow HeRos here, since I "unfortunately" ;) agreed to play devil's advocate and find arguments for H/Hr.
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OMG! Danger warnings! I hope ppl will stick to debate and not fight. Ohh just thinking of the shipper wars makes me get nightmares.
I'm ofcourse a R/hr shipper. And a Ron fan. So here I rest my case.

I think Harry needs a woman like Ginny. She is independent she is like Harry i many ways. They are soul mates.

Ron and Hermione are the oposite attraction couple. Hermione is extreem in her way and and needs a Ron type in her life and the same with Ron.
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  • 4 weeks later...
I am a R/Hr shipper and as someone requested here are some of the reasons for that

- Hermione never got jealous of Harry's crush on Cho or his feelings for Ginny while she got extremely jealous over Fluer kissing Ron on the cheek and of course when Ron hooks up with Lavender (just like how Harry never got jealous of Hermione going to the Yule Ball with Viktor Krum).

- There is no passion between Harry and Hermione whereas Ron and Hermione have a lot of passion for one another.

- Ron and Hermione enjoy spending time together alone while Harry actually grew bored when he had to spend a extended period of time alone with Hermione.

- Hermione never feared Ron but there were instances where she was actually scared of Harry's temper.

- In CoS it was the thought of Hermione which convinced Ron to go into the Forbidden Forest and face his greatest fear (at least his greatest fear when he was 12).

- Ron was constantly defending Hermione from others, he tried to curse and beat up Malfoy several times after he insulted Hermione and he even yelled at Snape when Snape insulted her in class.

- Ron notices things about Hermione that Harry doesn't notice. It was always Ron pointing out that something odd was going on with Hermione in PoA (later discovered to be her using a timeturner) and in GoF it was Ron who noticed straight away that Hermione's teeth were different (Harry didn't notice until Ron pointed it out).

- The books are from Harry's perspective and in the books Hermione is never described as attractive. Harry was not attracted to Hermione and as a result Hermione was not desribed as attractive in the books. If the books were from Ron's perspective i think Hermione would have been desribed very differently.
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[quote name='GingerCat' timestamp='1295568378' post='51034']
I am a R/Hr shipper and as someone requested here are some of the reasons for that

- Hermione never got jealous of Harry's crush on Cho or his feelings for Ginny while she got extremely jealous over Fluer kissing Ron on the cheek and of course when Ron hooks up with Lavender (just like how Harry never got jealous of Hermione going to the Yule Ball with Viktor Krum).

- There is no passion between Harry and Hermione whereas Ron and Hermione have a lot of passion for one another.

- Ron and Hermione enjoy spending time together alone while Harry actually grew bored when he had to spend a extended period of time alone with Hermione.

- Hermione never feared Ron but there were instances where she was actually scared of Harry's temper.

- In CoS it was the thought of Hermione which convinced Ron to go into the Forbidden Forest and face his greatest fear (at least his greatest fear when he was 12).

- Ron was constantly defending Hermione from others, he tried to curse and beat up Malfoy several times after he insulted Hermione and he even yelled at Snape when Snape insulted her in class.

- Ron notices things about Hermione that Harry doesn't notice. It was always Ron pointing out that something odd was going on with Hermione in PoA (later discovered to be her using a timeturner) and in GoF it was Ron who noticed straight away that Hermione's teeth were different (Harry didn't notice until Ron pointed it out).

- The books are from Harry's perspective and in the books Hermione is never described as attractive. Harry was not attracted to Hermione and as a result Hermione was not desribed as attractive in the books. If the books were from Ron's perspective i think Hermione would have been desribed very differently.
[/quote]

This!!!! Ron and Hermione belong together since the first time they met :)
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[quote name='GingerCat' timestamp='1295568378' post='51034']
[b]...
The books are from Harry's perspective and in the books Hermione is never described as attractive. Harry was not attracted to Hermione and as a result Hermione was not desribed as attractive in the books. If the books were from Ron's perspective i think Hermione would have been desribed very differently.[/b][/quote]

THIS 100%!
[i]This[/i] is basically the main reason why I am a R/Hr shipper as well, and could never be otherwise.
The books are told from Harry's POV and therefore we know Harry's thoughts. He never expressed any attaction for Hermione -as opposed to Cho and Ginny, where we clearly KNOW how he felt- and therefore there is basically no reason for the readers to assume he hold any romantic feelings for her.

I also agree that if the books had been told from Ron's perspective, we would have had a [i]much[/i] more detailed description of Hermione. :)
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[quote name='vida' timestamp='1295581827' post='51098']
The books are told from Harry's POV and therefore we know Harry's thoughts.
[/quote]
Gotta disagree here. The books are not first person POV and are definitely not Harry's POV. He is the protagonist but it is not his POV. The Harry Potter books are told from a third person limited POV. Thus the statement that Hermione is not attractive comes from the author or the teller of the story but not any one character.
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1295629125' post='51208']
Gotta disagree here. The books are not first person POV and are definitely not Harry's POV. He is the protagonist but it is not his POV. The Harry Potter books are told from a third person limited POV. Thus the statement that Hermione is not attractive comes from the author or the teller of the story but not any one character.
[/quote]

Then why is it established that both Cho and Ginny are considered attractive and Hermione is not?

There are plenty of times in the books when we are in Harry's head and we know what he is thinking (almost all the time in fact) so i don't see how you can say that.
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[quote name='GingerCat' timestamp='1295636259' post='51242']
Then why is it established that both Cho and Ginny are considered attractive and Hermione is not?

There are plenty of times in the books when we are in Harry's head and we know what he is thinking (almost all the time in fact) so i don't see how you can say that.
[/quote]
I don't know why it is established that Cho and Ginny are considered attractive. You'd have to ask the author that. I haven't read the books in a while so can you refresh my memory in what passages it states that they are attractive or considered attractive?

If it were first person POV then it would be written like The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn where it opens with "You don't know about me without you have read a book called "The Adventures of Tom Sawyer," but that ain't no matter." He uses the pronouns me and I and it is Huck telling the story. As opposed to The Adventures of Tom Sawyer which allows the reader to be in the character's head but is clearly told from the third person point of view.

There are also those times where we see action when Harry is not present at all. This is not consistent with a first person POV.

Rowling has often said that for the most part she is Hermione. So that is probably the reason that Hermione is described as plain or unattractive. It's a bit of self deprecation as most people don't see themselves as attractive. Edited by The Dude
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1295643381' post='51264']
Rowling has often said that for the most part she is Hermione. So that is probably the reason that Hermione is described as plain or unattractive. It's a bit of self deprecation as most people don't see themselves as attractive.
[/quote]

The problem with that theory is that there is evidence that Hermione IS attractive. Out of all the girls in the school it was her that Viktor Krum wanted to take to the Yule Ball and a even bigger clue is McLaggen's interest in her. McLaggen isn't the type of guy who would ever go out with a girl that he didn't think was good looking and the fact that he went with Hermione to Slughorn's party shows that he finds her attractive.
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[quote name='GingerCat' timestamp='1295644863' post='51267']
The problem with that theory is that there is evidence that Hermione IS attractive. Out of all the girls in the school it was her that Viktor Krum wanted to take to the Yule Ball and a even bigger clue is McLaggen's interest in her. McLaggen isn't the type of guy who would ever go out with a girl that he didn't think was good looking and the fact that he went with Hermione to Slughorn's party shows that he finds her attractive.
[/quote]
That's more of a plot hole than anything. The fact stands the books are written in third person. You're not gonna find any literary analysts that will call the books first person POV. Yes, the books spend more time telling us what Harry is thinking and feeling more than anyone else but that's because he's the protagonist. Same goes for Tom Sawyer, we hear his thoughts more than any other character because he's the protagonist but it is not written from a first person POV.

It is a literary convention, not my opinion.
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1295645810' post='51271']
That's more of a plot hole than anything. The fact stands the books are written in third person. You're not gonna find any literary analysts that will call the books first person POV. [b]Yes, the books spend more time telling us what Harry is thinking and feeling more[/b] than anyone else but that's because he's the protagonist. Same goes for Tom Sawyer, we hear his thoughts more than any other character because he's the protagonist but it is not written from a first person POV.

It is a literary convention, not my opinion.
[/quote]

It does and in the 7 books other than a brief moment at the Yule Ball Harry never thinks Hermione is attractive.

We also know that what Harry perceives is sometimes wrong as he thought that the reason Tonks was upset in HBP was because of Sirius's death. He didn't have a clue about her relationship issues with Remus. In other words we cannot take what Harry thinks as gospel as he can be wrong.
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[quote name='GingerCat' timestamp='1295646160' post='51273']
It does and in the 7 books other than a brief moment at the Yule Ball Harry never thinks Hermione is attractive.

We also know that what Harry perceives is sometimes wrong as he thought that the reason Tonks was upset in HBP was because of Sirius's death. He didn't have a clue about her relationship issues with Remus. In other words we cannot take what Harry thinks as gospel as he can be wrong.
[/quote]
This is why it's called third person limited point of view. The POV stays close to Harry because he is the protagonist (the book is named after him after all). But it does also stray into other people's POV or perspective from time to time. It is not told exclusively through Harry's eyes.
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[quote name='The Dude' timestamp='1295646839' post='51283']
This is why it's called third person limited point of view. The POV stays close to Harry because he is the protagonist (the book is named after him after all). But it does also stray into other people's POV or perspective from time to time. It is not told exclusively through Harry's eyes.
[/quote]

Harry must be a extremely fickle person then as he only seems to fall for girls that are very attractive. According to you at least the character descriptions are not from Harry's perspective meaning that Harry does only fall for attractive girls. I don't know why you would be in favor of this as it makes Harry look like a arse.
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